NBA Player That Outperforms Hedge Funds By Trading Stock Options – Jontay Porter
EPISODE 5 – Jontay Porter, NBA Player for the Memphis Grizzlies and Co-Founder of The Financial Cloud
On top of a demanding NBA schedule, Jontay has quietly built a career as a very successful trader.
- how he turned $50k into $200k in 3 days and how he’s gone from $5k to $100k
- how overcoming basketball injuries relate to being a great trader
- what advice he has for all the beginners entering the stock market today
- which trading strategies he favors
- the importance of investing
Sign up for a RobinHood account if you’re interested in investing in stocks. If you sign up via my link, you and I both receive a free stock!
Sign up for a Coinbase account if you’re interesting in Bitcoin and cryptocurrency. If you sign up via my link, you and I both receive $10 of Bitcoin for free!
Podcast episode & show notes below!
- Follow Jontay’s Trading Twitter profile
- Co-Founder of The Financial Cloud (Twitter / Website / Discord)
- Article on The Ringer that gives a lot of background on Jontay as a person
- Proof of the recent $50k-$200k in 3 days
- Ray Dalio’s “The Changing World Order“
This transcript was automatically generated using Descript.
Ismail: [00:00:00] Welcome to the bound to be rich podcast, where I attempt to reverse engineer people who seem to be successful, no matter the circumstances, so that you can apply those lessons to your own life. I’m your host is ed. In this episode, we are joined by John TA Porter, a professional NBA player with a Memphis Grizzlies who was secretly also a very successful option trader.
We talk about mental strength and how it’s important for everything from overcoming a sports. To becoming a profitable trader JTE recently turned $50,000 into 200,000. In three days. He’s also grown $5,000 into a hundred thousand dollars in the past. So he’s got a proven track record. He now even has hundreds of other traders following him.
We get into what he’s learned from trading and his advice to all the beginners that are getting into the market. Right now, we also get into a bunch of other stuff like Bitcoin, the importance of investing in general and what really creates a fulfilling life. Let’s dive in.[00:01:00]
Ante. Welcome to the show, man. Thanks for coming on.
Jontay: Of course, man. Thanks for
Ismail: having me. I guess you’re most known for being a basketball player, but I’ll be totally honest with you, man. I had no idea. you were an NBA player. I actually was following you mostly for your trading. So. Kudos to you for being multi-talented.
Jontay: Yeah, man, that’s really, honestly, most of my followers, I kind of wanted to keep it that way too, just because, um, like I don’t really advertise it on my main social medias and kind of just let my crowd develop naturally just from trading. It’s just something I love doing. So, uh, it’s like two different worlds, honestly.
Ismail: Why’d you decide to separate it. Is it just because you wanted to like earn, uh, a trading following? Like, not because you’re famous, just because you’re a
Jontay: good trader. Yeah, honestly, that was mostly it. And I’ve never really liked to use [00:02:00] my basketball platform to gain anything. And I felt like that kind of be cheating my way through the process of trading.
And you see all these guys with tons of followers and cult-like followings and not that that’s who I aspire to be or anything. I just wanna help people with my free time. But, um, I didn’t wanna. Do that by basically inviting non, uh, financial people to hop on over to my trading Twitter, just because they get to interact with me.
You know what I mean? I just wanted it to be people that were in that world already.
Ismail: Yeah. I mean, hopefully then you take that as a big compliment, because like I said, I had no idea. Um, yeah. And when I, when I saw that, I was like, wow, this guy sounds interesting. He got a whole career. That’s really demanding and he’s still good at trading.
Uh, cuz I saw some numbers that uh, backed up that you were good. But if you don’t mind, I have to ask some questions about basketball because if I don’t, people will yell at me but of course I promise I’ll, uh, segue and you’ll see where I go with this, but
Jontay: no, it’s not like it’s offensive or anything. Go ahead.
Whatever you wanna ask. Just
Ismail: a [00:03:00] couple general questions. Cause I know like even me,
How do you feel as a Basketball player?
Ismail: I always dreamed about being an NBA player, hitting the game, winning shot, you know, a lot of kids dream of that, but I’m curious like once you get there, uh, what’s it really like, like what does it really take to make it cuz a lot of people don’t.
Jontay: Yeah. I mean, obviously I’ve been blessed immensely, uh, with natural gifts that not a lot of people are blessed with like height and you know, just. The athletic capabilities, but, uh, it is a lot of hard work. And like you said, a lot of people have the dream to make it. And only so many people do. So for me to have made it, that’s kind of like fulfilling a lifelong dream.
Um, obviously I still have aspirations within this world, but to have made it is a big, big accomplishment. And, uh, it’s a lot different than what you think. And. It’s it’s really grueling. It’s a long season. This season in particular is a little bit different just because of our current circumstances, but, uh, it’s a grueling season.
And within that, you still have a lot of free time because yeah, you’re working out a [00:04:00] lot. You have games almost every other day, but you have all this free time and it’s like, that’s what separates good from great players is what they decide to do with that free time. So, um, luckily I’ve had a lot of free time to trade lately.
I’m still dealing with a little knee injury and, uh, haven’t been playing or anything, but that’s gonna change pretty soon. And, um, no matter what I’m doing with that free time, as long as I’m being productive, I feel like at the, of the day I rest got better in some area. So, um, that’s really, yeah. I mean, it’s, it’s just a crazy world.
It’s not a 95, but it kind of feels like it sometimes with the, you know, you’re, you’re either at the gym doing basketball or you’re at. You know, slack him, but there’s a lot you can do with every time
Your other aspirations.
Ismail: you mentioned other aspirations, like what kind of aspirations do
Jontay: you have? Yeah, I mean, really, I just wanna better myself in every area and, and I have a lot of interests, a lot of hobbies, trading, being one of them.
Um, my aspirations [00:05:00] just to be great. I feel like, and when I’m, when I’m at home and I just have a urge to just sit at home, watch Netflix or play video games, like, yeah, that’s fun. And it’s fulfilling. I, I feel like I, when I go to bed at night, I’m just not happy with myself for that day. So every day I try to get better at something and I don’t have like major, you know, end all be all goals because I don’t think those are fulfilling.
Like, I’m not like I, I need to be MVP of the league or I wanna make a billion from trading. It’s not like that because those are just, uh, you know, temporary goals. And once you get them, you’ll. You’ll have a feeling of emptiness. Um, for me, I just wanna get better at whatever I do that day. Even if it’s just 1%, those things will add up and I can look back five years in the future.
Look back to now and, uh, see that growth.
Ismail: I totally relate to that. I think maybe it’s, it’s also not good sometimes because I’m so obsessed with like being productive and getting better. Like, my wife always tells me, like, you gotta calm down, man. Just take a [00:06:00] breath, enjoy, enjoy life. But for whatever reason, I guess, I dunno, it seems like you relate.
I have that in me where I just feel like I’m wasting time if I’m not improving or learning or doing something. Yeah.
Jontay: And even if it’s, uh, Even if it’s not necessarily being a hundred percent active, a hundred percent of the time, I think that’s what life is all about is getting better at something, seeing improvement.
And if you’re not doing that, then like basically using the fruit of your labors and enjoying life. And I think your wife has a point, like life’s all about experiences and when I’m not working towards getting better or something, I like. Enjoy life doing natural stuff like going outside or going to the park, whatever, hanging out with my dog.
But I feel most lazy and like unproductive when I’m just playing video games or, uh, watching shows that’s really the times that kind like myself, what I’m doing with my life. Really not, it is just video games. Those were fine. No, no,
Ismail: no. We can get, we can get deep. I like [00:07:00] that too. I actually, you know, a lot of people don’t listen to this podcast.
It’s about. Like the name is bound to be rich. So it’s people that feel different than their friends. They feel like they’re a little weird, like they’re destined for more. And I find. Um, it’s hard for them to relate to their friends because a lot of their friends, like all they wanna do is talk about video games and sports and stuff like that.
They’re not really focused on like getting better or listening to podcasts, reading, like learning about trading. They’re just kind of chilling. Um, which is, which is fine, I guess. I mean, who are we the judge, but, uh, I agree with you that you wanna give back and help and get better instead of just like consuming and taking things in and not doing.
Jontay: it’s really just a, I think a good word for that is complacency. And how you said kind of just chilling. That’s really the thing that scares me most, um, cause it’s okay to enjoy the fruit of your labor, but, uh, if you really are just chilling and watching other people be great at what they do, I think that’s when you’re in trouble.
So, uh, I like the name of your podcast, so that’s great. Great meaning too. Thank you,
Unheard things about Professional Players.
Ismail: [00:08:00] What are some things that most people don’t know? Like what are some things that people who dream about being in a professional league? Like, they’d be surprised to hear.
Jontay: Sure. I think there’s a, there’s so many different things.
Um, I mean, lemme think of one thing, I guess one thing would be, uh, well, that’s such a subjective answer, but for me personally, I thought this is kind of when I realized. When I had this total mindset shift of, I gotta be doing something to better myself or have, you know, these goals, whatever. Cause I feel like once I, I thought once I got here, everything would be great.
Like I’d have money, I’d be happy. I really have whatever I want. And yeah, that’s true. But it, that’s not like happiness. I feel like, and people, you gotta do something else. You gotta have different goals, different hobbies, whatever. And I. If you don’t, you’re left sad. And that’s why you see so many NBA players speaking out now about mental health stuff.[00:09:00] It can really be a drag because people think you just have a perfect life. You have everything you ever wanted and materialistically wise. Yeah, you do. But that’s not, that’s not really happiness. I think a lot of people that aren’t here, think if they did have what we had, they’d be, they’d be perfectly happy with life.
You know what I.
Ismail: Yeah. I mean, I, I guess the grass always looks greener on the other side, but, uh, exactly there, there’s that saying where, I dunno if you’ve heard this before, where if everyone sits at the table and everyone puts their cards on the table of all their problems and their issues, uh, people wouldn’t change cards with someone else.
Like you, you’re kind of, um, you want your own life compared to other people’s problems, I guess is a better way of saying it. Hundred percent. All right. So I just wanna touch on, cause I think this has to do with trading and business and anything in general, um,
How overcoming basketball injuries relate to being a great trader?
Ismail: like mental strength, right? So I saw that you dealt, you said you dealt with an injury.
I think you got injured twice. Yeah. That that’s gotta be tough mentally, man. You, you work so hard to get to where you are and then you can’t play. Cuz you’re hurt. [00:10:00] Talk to me about how that affects you mentally and how you get over that. Because I personally think like trading, um, it’s easy to learn charts and patterns and all that stuff for me.
The hardest part is the mental part.
Jontay: Oh yeah, for sure. Um, I mean, you hit it right in the head. The mental part is the hardest thing and I think. Well, one, I didn’t start trading. I didn’t get into it until I got hurt basketball. Cuz I had a big knee injury, had this major surgery and was in bed for eight weeks and I’d always been into like investing in crypto and seeing my money work for itself.
But. I didn’t actively trade until I got hurt and kind of learned it by myself. Um, and yeah, it was, it was all charts, all that. Well first lemme, sorry, I’m getting off topic. Let me answer the question of, uh, you know, mental fortitude and whatnot. That probably was the hardest thing I had dealt with, uh, especially with basketball stuff, uh, up until that point in my life.
And it’s easy to kind of be like, oh shoot, we’re [00:11:00] never gonna play in the NBA. And my. My career’s kind of ruined because I was projected lottery pickup until that point. And then once I got hurt twice back to back that didn’t go drafted. It was just like, I could have easily given up there and just gone and done something else.
My brother was already in the NBA, I guess I could have begged to work for him. I don’t know, but I still had dreams and I felt like I still had a chance to make it. And, uh, I kind of just had to remind myself that life’s not all about basketball. Um, cause up until that point, that was all my dream. All my goal was just to make it to the NBA and I knew I’d be happy, but.
That wasn’t looking as sure as it was a few months prior. So I guess I just kind of reminded myself life so much more. I can learn more things. I can do more stuff. And that’s kind of when trading became a new hobby and I started learning more about that. So how much fun that was while simultaneously working to come back in basketball.
So I guess that was kind of the first moment. Where, I guess you could say I was rock bottom, but it kind of taught me a new way of thinking about things, um, and just keep pushing forward. Keep moving forward. Easier said [00:12:00] than done. Sure. But I think if you can master that, you can really do anything and, uh, to go in trading, like you said, you can learn all the charts and whatnot.
That’s super easy. It’s more about managing mentally, how you do with these charts and how you do with these plays. Uh, that’s what separates the people that blow up their accounts from. Millionaires in this, in this business. All right.
Ismail: So let’s dive into that a little bit,
Trading Psychology:Control your mind
Ismail: because from my experience, uh, and I’ve always been more of an investor.
I just got into trading more, uh, I would say in the last year. Okay. And to me, like hands down, that is by far the most difficult aspect in a lot of ways, like, for example, A lot of people are not, I, I don’t think most people are cut out for this. To be honest with you. I tell my friends, like you’ve gotta be like a little sick in the head to be, to be like day trading options, because you have to be able to like, look at your account, drop 60% and still have like a belief that your play’s gonna play out.
Um, even if you’re up a lot, not letting that get to you and get your ego [00:13:00] pumped up. Uh, there’s just so many ways that it affects you. I’m just curious. Do you have any advice on that? Like from what you’ve learned, how do you keep like a rational, calm mind, even when things are moving against you or they’re in your favor?
Jontay: Yeah, I. I like what you said you had to kind be sick in the head to, uh, be successful at it. I’ve a lot of people have reached out to me, like friends and family talking about, let me get into it, let me get into it. But I kind of warn ’em like, yo, especially at first you might lose some money, but it’s always about bouncing back and just learning from it.
I think experience is the biggest teacher for me. Cause at first, I mean, not that I was putting in that much money, but I blew my account like five times in the beginning and. Just slowly learned from it slowly learned from it got better with the risk management, all that jazz. And, um, yeah, I, I think I just have a, this is gonna sound bad and I don’t recommend, like you just take it at face value.
Um, but there’s a deeper meaning behind it. I kind of just started looking at money differently when it was in my trading account. I almost treated it like a video game where, uh, [00:14:00] she’s not panicking too much if I lost some, almost looking at it, just like numbers on a screen, which it is in a sense. And.
Wasn’t freaking out. I only put in money when I was that I was okay with losing and just played it, played by my rules, wrote down my rules every day and stuck to em. Now I think if you just stick to your rules and it’s so easy to say that, and then go out and your holy Tesla, when you see everyone making millions off it.
But if you just do that, man, I think it’s just habit by habit day by day. Following your habits, you you’ll be okay. It. Learning how to follow your own rules is the hardest thing about it.
Ismail: I actually think I, I, that’s such a great way of looking at it. I, I feel like lately I look at it the same way where I’ve kind of detached from the money and it’s just like numbers on a screen.
Right. And I, I feel like once you get to that, when you get to that point, it’s more likely that you’ll be successful because now you’re not like emotionally, uh, invested in the rollercoaster ride. Um, exactly. But I biggest go ahead. Go ahead.
Jontay: That’s OK. Go ahead. [00:15:00] I was gonna say, like the biggest mistake I had made in the past was okay, I’m doing great when I’m making money, but then if my account’s down 30% and then I cut losses, like, oh, I gotta make it back.
Let me put 50% of my account into this play. And that’s when the snowball of losses starts rolling. I think that’s the most dangerous thing. So it’s easy to follow your rules when you’re making money and OK. I’ll take profit at 30%. I’ll cut losses at 10%, but then when you take a big position and it’s down 20% overnight, Which you said options are just so volatile.
That’s when, uh, your, your, uh, your rules get tempted to break.
Ismail: Yeah. I feel like with options specifically, like that’s normal, like 20, 30% moves is normal, so you have to be comfortable with that. Otherwise you shouldn’t play it exactly. But, uh, I actually think it’s good to lose money in the beginning, to be honest with you, because I’ve had experiences with trading where I’ve made like tons of like unbelievable amounts of money in one trade.
And then I realize personally that affects me in a negative way where I, [00:16:00] I think I get like more aggressive afterwards and I, I lose. I lose a lot after that. So yeah, like keeping that levelheadedness is really difficult. It’s easy to talk about it, but it’s not that easy to do it.
Jontay: I remember like my very first.
Okay. So I had started a Rob hood account in the beginning and was just doing equity, you know, buying and selling stocks. I think it was lucking coffee back in the day, if you remember that stock. But, um, then I looked in the settings and enabled options. I was like, oh, what is this? Started messing around with.
Yellowed everything, which was like $2,000 into apple calls for their event, new iPhone or whatever. It went up to K the next day, put all 10 K into Roku that on top of world that, uh, that night and was only 18 years old. So I was, you know, a lot of money for that at that age. Um, and then I just kept, you know, yoing my whole account to each thing, each thing.
And then overnight I. Uh, I forget what it was, Roku. Again, I got back into Roku. They had like a [00:17:00] offering a share offering and then lost my whole position and vowed never to trade again. But that, that loss kind of just left like a scar in me that never, I, I like refused to do that now. And I think, like you said, losing so early on, although that was a lot of.
Even if it’s a hundred dollars, you lose all your money. That just changes the way you think. Granted, I had to do it four or five times. And, uh, before I got the hang of this trading thing, but I think, yeah, mentally, it’s just, you learn a new thing every time you lose
Ismail: money. You had to do it four or five times for it to really like burn in and sink in.
Jontay: I wasn’t, I wasn’t yelling at my count after that, but I was slowly but surely losing my money.
Ismail: I mean, I think that, I think, uh, that’s just the uncomfortable truth. Like people think you’re just gonna put it in and it’s gonna be, you know, a hundred X in a week. Uh, you most likely you’re gonna lose it and you’ll learn.
And if you really wanna get good at it and make something out of it, you’ll stick with it. And, and over time you get good enough to be consistently profit. That’s why I’m sure you’ve seen the [00:18:00] stats where like 90% of people off traders fail, I think was a give up within like the first couple months they lose
Jontay: their money’s was talking somebody about that’s that statistic is little misleading.
Like, so quit after lose a little bit of money. They just get freaked out and just go hands that. So people that stick it out, I think are the ones that will obviously are doing pretty.
Ismail: So, I, I, I actually first found you in these discord groups. Like I was in the ACE ventures group. I’m still, I know you’re in another group that I got into the financial cloud one.
Yeah. Uh, I just, not that active in that one yet. I’m, I’m more active in following the ACE ventures and all the guys in there.
How did Community traders find you?
Ismail: How do like these groups find you? How do they know that you’re good at trading and recruit you? How does that happen?
Jontay: Honestly, I couldn’t even tell you how it all happened. It, uh, the course of a year, yeah.
Was wild. So was initially, um, you know, Thomas Watts, he one of the traders, but he doesn’t really talk as much anymore. [00:19:00] He followed on I for and saw that posted something like retweeted, something. And he asked me about it. And then I joined one of his groups at the time. I wasn’t the greatest trader, but I just kept learning, kept learning.
And then me and Tommy met up and won and then I got invited into ACEs group and then I made my own discord. And then now I just co-founded the, uh, financial cloud and I’m in that one now. So it was kind of wild how it all happened, but I’m really thankful for it. Cause ACEs ventures for sure helped me kinda jumpstart my own following and.
I’m not active in that either today, but, uh, we’re all friends now. It’s just a community of traders. I love it.
Ismail: I mean, it’s kind of, and I, I guess this requires faith or believing in F or something, but it’s just funny how. Like you, you got into trading because of your injury. Right? Right. And I’ve had similar experiences too, where like something bad happens and you’re depressed.
And through time you realize that, Hey you, [00:20:00] not that you’re grateful for being injured for example, but because of that, other things come up and who knows, you might become like a really successful. Multibillion dollar trader and it all happened cuz you were laying in bed for eight, eight weeks, right? You never know
It really is crazy. I’m a firm believer that there’s good. That comes out of all, all bad situations. And I think I’ve not that I would go back and hope that I re tear my knee up, not once but twice, but I think there.
Advice to aspiring traders.
Jontay: I’m really thankful for how everything’s turned out. Uh, not only with basketball, but like you said, with trading with, uh, my perspective on life in general, like not putting all my stock per se, into basketball.
Um, yeah, it really is wild. How all that worked out.
Ismail: So it sounds, and, and I’m sure you see this too, where like everybody and their mother and their aunt and their neighbor, they’re all getting into trading right now, which, um, I’m not sure what that says about where things are going. Right. But what is your advice for people that are beginning?
Like, should they get into options? Should they stay [00:21:00] away? What are some rules that you found that work like what’s general advice for people that are just getting started?
Jontay: Well, I find. Um, especially with people that ask me questions and ask for help is that too many people are getting in too early without enough knowledge.
Cause when you look at trading, you think of a, get rich quick scheme, which it can be. Uh, but as we discussed earlier, you usually end up losing all the money that you gain. You just get more. But yeah, I would say people are getting in too quick without learning the fundamentals, learning stuff, uh, learning how to manage their own positions.
I mean, I see people in the ACEs group that just put everything into what he says. Don’t even, they just keep asking, like, when do I get out? When do I get out? Not knowing how to manage their own positions. Uh, and that that’s just for options. I think equity is a whole monster, but I think just educate yourself is iffy because you know, that’s not real money.
The psychology of it, like we said, is the biggest thing. Uh, and then just slowly into it, see how you do with it. Don’t quit just cause you lose money. I think money losing money is the biggest teacher as we [00:22:00] discussed. And yeah. Surround yourself by other good traders. Like I have, I wouldn’t be had the trader I am today without consulting and balancing ideas off other people.
Uh, yeah, man, that that’s really just a few bits and pieces of advice I’d give. So like,
Story behind $50k into $200k in 3 days.
Ismail: like most other things invest in learning. Um, you you’ve gotten obviously pretty good after. All the learnings that you did. I saw a post recently that I’ll I’ll link to in the show notes where I think it was like 50,000 to 200,000 in three days.
Right. Something like that. Yeah. Yeah. What was the, what was the story behind that? That’s crazy.
Jontay: Yeah, man. I, I like to do that. So, uh, I have a few man accounts, like on thinker swim, and I have one with Charles Schwab and whatnot, where. Those are my more safe trades per se, but Robin hoods, which is my account where I try to grow it times 5s.[00:23:00]
And then, uh, 50,000 and 200,000 in a few days, I forget what trade I think that was on Tesla and Neo and a few other trades that were just wild, but. Yeah, man. I like, I, I think I go against a lot of the typical rules of like safe traders with that account because I just try to grow it as quickly as possible.
And obviously I’m not doing this as my main source of income. It’s more of a side gig, uh, where I try to, it’s like my fun money. If I, if I do good, I withdraw it. And. Put it either in savings or bless myself with something, but, uh, yeah man, if not, if not, you’re depressed.
Ismail: yeah. exactly. So are you like net net up from all those, uh, risky plays in Robin hood?
Like you said, he takes some out. Uh, so overall, do you think you’ve been up or down?
Jontay: Oh, a hundred percent up. I, uh, I don’t play with too much. Like once I get up there, I withdraw it. I’ll restart with a few.
Ismail: So I, I, how do you,
Your confidence to stick with the Neo stock.
Ismail: I’ve noticed like, uh, for example, recently I was in Neo, um, and I think you were heavy in [00:24:00] Neo and I saw, if I remember correctly, you tweeted that you were holding it for after Neo day.
Yeah. Right. Is that true? What gives you that confidence? Because for my experience, I got burned with events like either earnings or, or like Tesla day, battery day, whatever kind of day. I got ingrained in me to sell before the event. So like what gave you that con it worked out really well. Um, Neo shot up afterwards, like, but what gave you that confidence to stick with it while everyone else is like not played safe and
Jontay: get out?
Right. I mean, I’ve also gotten burned. I remember I played Tesla battery day and I got screwed, but to
Ismail: be fair that’s Elon’s fault. You shouldn’t tweeted
Jontay: I also got burned on a. Tesla was at the unveil, the cyber truck. I thought they were just gonna have a sick design. And then the window cracked. I was depressed that night.
Yeah. I’ve gotten burned on those two actually in the past, but the play, I just saw that all highs. It was so everybody had good sentiment on, I got a couple upgrades and just with I, I [00:25:00] did some research on their technology and what they had to offer. They were unveiling a new sedan and I was just like, They’re bound to partner with somebody.
I knew that for sure. For sure. Just with all our new technology coming out and I don’t know, man. I mean, it’s always risky to hold for events, but I was pretty darn sure. Or else I wouldn’t have tweeted. I would gotten a lot of hate if hadn’t worked out, but I was just really sure. Young man,
Ismail: that’s the downside of putting the stuff publicly is when you’re wrong.
People, people make sure you know
Jontay: that you’re wrong. I know that’s the one thing. That’s why I don’t do anything for like, I don’t accept them tips. I don’t. I don’t have anything paid right now for me or one on one tutor sessions. Cause I’m just like one, I’m doing this for fun in my free time. I don’t wanna spend too much time tutoring individuals.
And also, you know, if I, if I take their money and then later lose their money, they’re gonna be just. Pissed and blackmail me or not blackmail me, uh, blacklist me and never trade off me again, you know? Yeah.
Ismail: I, I’m not, I dunno if I’m a fan of all these like [00:26:00] alerts and like calling out entries. Cause I feel like, like with my friends, I could give ’em a great play, like a great stock, but it’s not enough.
You have to know how to follow it. You have to know when the plan is no longer in play. When the PR broke when to get out how to get out, scaling and scaling out. Right. It’s not as simple. Here’s an alert and just go do it, you know?
Jontay: Yeah. I mean that, and then also if you do that, it, it encourages mindless sheep not to call trader sheep or anything, but it kind of is when they just take an entry by that expiration date, by that strike and bombard you with, when do I get out?
When do I get out instead of giving them trade ideas and. Not even telling ’em when you get out usually, uh, and let them kind of fair for themselves. Cause that’s the only way they learn is if they do things themselves. Uh, so that’s, I’m also with you on that boat.
Ismail: So. Just on Neo. I feel like you said you research their technology.
I like their business model too. Like they sell the cars for a lot cheaper and then they lease the batteries out. Yeah. Um, so I’m like, oh, [00:27:00] that’s different. Uh, and even though it’s so hyped up, I feel like that might be a great long term play. If like, it doesn’t have to be anything like Tesla, like a 10th of Tesla would be a great long term investment for if Neo pulls through.
Jontay: No, I agree with you. I’ve been adding shares since it was like $5. And that, that wasn’t too long ago, actually. It’s just been real how quickly it came up to this price level. But I still like it, like you said, it’s not, it’s not just following Tesla’s or trying to be a better Tesla. It’s like changing it up a bit, doing its own thing.
It’s in China with which is a huge GV market. And uh, I mean, it’s doing really well. You see their sales year over year and. All these models. And then the chart itself is just gorgeous when we played the breakout. So, I mean, I wouldn’t be surprised and you see how the stock market is the last year or so people find a stock that runs and they just throw all their money into it and you see these crazy momentum plays.
Ismail: yeah, it doesn’t have to make sense. Like people say, oh, it’s overvalued. I mean, Tesla value for three [00:28:00] years,
Jontay: man. Exactly. So we’re not in the olden days where stocks have to follow. Know, principles to the T it’s things have been
Ismail: really weird. So, so let me ask you,
Your thoughts on Stock Chart.
Ismail: because like I, I said before I got into trading, I was really more of a long term investor.
Um, and I, you know, I’ve always heard, Hey, it’s you can’t get anything outta technical charts. It doesn’t tell you anything. It’s a bunch of hoopla. What do you say to people that still think that like the chart is just a chart? Like what? That doesn’t tell you anything, what’s your thoughts
Jontay: on that? I think that’s just people being lazy and not looking.
The facts or learning it themselves. I mean, there’s plenty of ways you can trade that are profitable. I’m not denying that, but to say that one doesn’t work and the other is the only one that does work, I think is foolish. Obviously charting does work cuz I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t just have this lucky run for year on year because I’m doing pretty well myself and all I do is look at the charts.
And obviously take a couple yellow calls that work out every once in a while. But, [00:29:00] uh,
Ismail: that, that brings up the average
Jontay: yeah, yeah. Brings up the average return, but no, I think chartings, I mean, that’s how I learned and I think that’s how I teach all my people. Like all my friends that wanna learn. And, uh, yeah, I mean, like we said, nothing really follows anything exactly anymore because you see those momentum plays that don’t follow charts.
They’re just go straight up parabolically but. For the most part, man charts really do work. Uh, there’s lots of ways to do it hundreds of millions of ways to do it. I’m sure. But, uh, I, I stick to what I learned and it’s only a few things, only few chart patterns I look for, but it really works for me.
Ismail: So if it was.
Do Patterns always work?
Ismail: This is what I always wonder about like, um, algorithms and AI and people build all these different tools and everyone’s looking for the same patterns. Right. But it can’t be that easy if it always worked. If the patterns were, or they worked most of the time, everyone would make a ton of money. So like, where’s the disconnect there.
Does it always work? Or how do you know when it won’t work?
Jontay: No, that’s typically why. I mean, I literally just [00:30:00] tweeted at Thanos because, um, he was like, yo, you should gotten with me a few days ago. Um, cause it was gearing was waiting for the, I was waiting for the shoulda gotten in for me personally, I, for the chart to itself.
Cause like you said it’s hundred percent or I would never lose, but I do sometimes. So I try to wait for the breakout. Sometimes there’s fake outs, but really I like a chart. I see it break that trend line. I. Built up. And then I get in and hope for the best, have my price targets there. If it, if it goes red, I have a quick stop loss, but, um, it’s really not about being a hundred percent, right.
It’s about being a hundred percent control of your emotions within the trade and being able to cut losses or being able to out those wins because the chart says a stock will get this high. And if it doesn’t you take profit there or cut losses. But yeah, I don’t think it’s really about being a hundred percent.
Right. It’s just. It’s managing those position positions that you are right in. [00:31:00]
Ismail: So, so I saw, when I woke up this morning, I saw you tweeted about FUO mm-hmm and I’m like, all right, I’m talking to this guy later. Let, let me get into this, play with him. And hopefully we got something nice to talk about. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
so I got in the morning. So this is an example for people who are listening, that haven’t traded. I got in this morning, I would, I would’ve for a slight pullback. It held this level. I think it was around 30, it was holding. So I jumped in, uh, but I got out quickly once it got to like the mid 30 twos, um, I took my profits.
It was really minor, but then I saw it pull back and I’m like, all right, great. I made the right move. But then at the end of the day, it just tore off like a monster. I think it went up to like 38, 39, and then I’m like, oh my God, I should have stayed in. JTE probably stayed in. He’s made a ton of money. I, I scalped it for like a couple points.
Jontay: right. I mean, money’s money, man. You can’t complain if you’re green. I think if that’s your way of doing it, you just want secure the gains. That’s great. For me, I’m a little more risky when I do these Robin hood trades. Um, I’m still in, you know, [00:32:00] me, I’m just waiting. I like the chart. I think it can keep going higher.
I saw it breakthrough on the daily chart and that’s when I got in this morning. So it was just a, it was a textbook trade, honestly.
Ismail: So can, can you tell us a little bit about like what you look for? Like how do you trade, what’s your style? How do you scalp? Do you wait for breakout getting, get out? Do you do options for longer term swing it?
Your trading strategies.
Ismail: How do you trade?
Jontay: Honestly, I can’t put myself in one category cuz I do a little bit of everything with my schedule right now with the NBA. I’m I like to day trade or scalp in the mornings before I go practice. And then I’m out of all positions for the three hours. I’m at the gym. I get home look for better positions or better trades that have, you know, the patterns formed throughout the day.
I either day trade or swing trade, uh, that, that afternoon. And then I’ll obviously I’m in some longer term positions. Uh, but all of it comes down. Technical analysis, looking for those charts. It’s just a matter what timeframe I’m looking at. So I scalp sometimes I, uh, day trade. I swing [00:33:00] trade. I’m not very good with like the leaps, cuz I get impatient just having my money sit there, but that’s kinda, I need to get better at that.
Cause a lot of money can be made there. So I think, uh, I’m just a technical analysis trader that looks at different time frames and does his best to help others make money with.
Your favourite stock.
Ismail: Do you have any, uh, top picks now, whether they’re short term plays, long term plays, anything that’s like high on your radar?
Jontay: Um, I mean, Neo is definitely one of ’em.
I think that’ll be a hundred dollars within a few months. But, like I said, I’m not good with those long, long swings. So I’m just day trading right now. It had a little bit of bad news right now because of the, uh, offering and then a downgrade. But that’s high on watch FBO obviously, cuz it just broke out.
I think it’ll have a really strong week. I think plantar planet tier, whatever PLT R that’s also one that, uh, was a hot stock a few weeks ago that I think is making a little resurgence. And then obviously Tesla is always on the hot watch [00:34:00] list, just cuz of what it is. Um, I mean there’s a ton of ’em the video is gonna be great.
I think, uh, I try not to over trade by complicating things or having too many call outs, but there’s always at least 10 stocks around my watch that I just set levels for. And if it breaks I get in, if it doesn’t then I just sit on my money. So, but uh, go ahead. Let me shout myself out. Follow me on Tay trays 11 and I’ll tell you when to get.
Ismail: Yeah. And I’ll definitely link to that in the share notes for sure. I, I recommend people follow you and I’m glad. No, no, it’s true. And I’m glad that, uh, the names you mentioned are all on my list too, so, uh, that’s great. I guess I’m on the right track. Let’s see. Yeah, man.
Your Investment in crypto.
Ismail: What about crypto? Cuz you mentioned it earlier and I think I read in an article that you, you bought it a long time ago.
Like what, what price was it at when you first bought it
Jontay: of Bitcoin? Uh, Bitcoin, I bought a 5,000 and that was like during the first little run and then I sold. Pretty high up there around 17,000. And I got back in around 6,000, uh, few [00:35:00] or a year later, whatever. And I’ve just been holding that since obviously position.
And now that I’m little more funds to it. So my average is a lot higher than that 6,000, but, um, I keep adding whenever there’s a dip this past couple days I’ve been adding and then I’m doing more research on the alt and getting there’s a bunch of man. I’m just trying to diversify my portfolio on that.
There’s gonna winners Los just market. Crypto is mainstream is already, already in the stock market. I. As more and more people pile into crypto, that thing is just gonna keep taking off. So I’m excited to see you what the next couple years look like.
Ismail: Yeah. Same now for, for crypto. Are you, like you said, you bought Bitcoin and got out, got back in.
Are you looking to trade it or are you just kind of stacking it and holding it for long term? Uh,
Jontay: similarly, similarly to how I have a couple trading accounts for the stock market, I have a couple accounts. Crypto one that I trade on, like actively. [00:36:00] And then one that I just buy and hold Coinbase. I just buy and hold because the fees are atrocious, but I love the interface kinda like Robin hood.
And then, uh, Binance, I do more trading on for the alt coins and whatnot. Cause there’s runners just like there is in the stock market, if not more. So, uh, there’s definitely opportunity, but I think you, uh, risk losing a lot of money if you don’t just buy Bitcoin and.
Ismail: Yeah, same here. I, I just keep, I have not sold actually at the beginning of 2020, I sold all my other, um, coins other all coins and just put it on to Bitcoin, man.
Jontay: So you, you got in the beginning of 2020, that means you’re, you’re doing very well.
Ismail: That that was liquidating my other stuff and going into Bitcoin, but I had Bitcoin from from years ago. So I just kind of keep stacking, I believe in the long. Potential, especially like, I don’t know if you read Ray Dalio’s work.
Um, so he, he recently wrote about, um, looking at previous periods of high inflation and what happened. Right. And literally in every single example in history, like back to the 16 [00:37:00] hundreds, it’s the same thing. Uh, things like gold or like, like things that you can’t manipulate the supply of go up in price by a lot.
And I feel like. With the money printing going on with the currency devaluation and all these other factors at play Bitcoin is, should be a home run. Like I can’t think of anything better to put your money into for long term than that personally.
Jontay: That’s what I’m saying, man. The only thing I could hold it back is too many regulations and whatnot.
But even with that, I think people will start to get into it just with the inflating dollar and. Tensions everywhere. So I’m with you, man. I wouldn’t be surprised. Tatras 11 prediction is a hundred thousand and 2021 for Bitcoin. We’ll see if it works out. Oh, I I’m with there.
Ismail: I’m with you on that one, for sure.
so I guess if
How did you make money to make an investment?
Ismail: I step back, you started trading. When you were younger, before you were in the NBA, where did you make your money to invest? Like, that’s another thing people struggle with that I wanna trade. I wanna invest, but I don’t have money. So as a young guy, where’d you make your money to put into Bitcoin, uh, and trade early.[00:38:00]
Jontay: Yeah. Um, well, when I was younger, I I’m really into technology stuff and I had, you know, an iPhone four back in the day and little computer and broke it, but learned how to fix it myself. So then I got, I made my own little iPhone repair shop in my parents’ basement and I’d have all these people coming by, uh, asking me to swap glass backs or, you know, customize it.
I do all that stuff. So that’s how I made my money as a. And then had a few thousand dollars, uh, stored up. I worked at a snow cone store or snow cone stand, um, made somebody from that. And then once I was at Mizzou for basketball, that’s when I tore my knee up. I had like a, I got $2,000 a month stipend and I would, I was living at home at the time because of my knee.
So I had like virtually no expenses. I just take all that and put it into crypto. So I just had a lot of, not a lot. Uh, but I had, I had a good. Pool of money saved up that I could get into start trading. I didn’t put it all in at once. Cause I was scared I would lose it, which [00:39:00] I ended up doing. But, uh, yeah, I had, I had a good little starting point.
I think there’s lots of ways to make money. It’s not just. Go to your nine to five, there’s lots of side hustles you can do to, uh, fund those trading accounts,
Ismail: that story of, uh, repair shop in seventh grade or whatever age you were. That’s awesome. That’s like an entrepreneur born and bred from the beginning.
Yeah. Like I said, that that’s for that’s for the listeners of the show too. Like people that listen to the show feel different. Uh, they’re doing weird things that their friends aren’t doing and like, like you fixing phones. Sure you were the only one in your school doing that. Um, is there anything else that you did as a side hustle or any other stories like that growing up?
Jontay: Not really. I mean, I, I walked the neighborhood dogs for, uh, for the cash. I babysitted I did lots of little gigs, but, uh, my main one was that repair store. Just like, like you said, I was the only one doing it. I remember in high school, my backpack, instead of like being filled with books, I just put a bunch of.
iPhone backs in it and then like [00:40:00] go to the bathroom and customize the kids’ phones for 20 bucks and, uh, take that back home. So, yeah, man, I’ve, I’ve been hustling since a kid. I just like to see, like to see my money grow. And then once I found crypto and seeing my money be able to grow like digitally, not just me going out and hustling myself, that’s kind of when my interest peaked with the whole trading.
Ismail: Yeah. You know, what’s crazy. I was just talking to, uh, family recently. Like I work my whole life to try to save money, do the right thing, you know, put a certain percentage of your money in the bank account. But like in the last year, just by putting it into crypto, I’ve made way more money, um, like much easier than hustling and working my whole life.
So I’m not trying to like downplay hustling because you need that initial cash. Yeah. But to me, it’s just bonkers. How, uh, you make a lot of your money with like minimal effort. If you just make the
Jontay: right decision. That’s what I’m saying, man. I think obviously each situation is unique for every person, but, uh, if you can get that initial capital.[00:41:00]
and make your money work for you. That that’s really the dream, the American dream, in my opinion, cuz working nine to five till you’re 65 is just not ideal to me. I, I, that was like my, a nightmare for me as a kid, I just wanted to go be able to have freedom to live life and go travel, do whatever. And I think I kind of took those steps to the kid to make that happen.
So obviously basketball worked out for me as well. But I think even without that, I laid the foundation at a young age. Obviously for me, it was really young, but even if you’re 20, 30, even 40, I mean, that’s still pretty young. So you can do stuff to free up your older years, for sure.
Ismail: Yeah. And then you don’t need, you know, like $500,000, like you mentioned a couple thousand here, a couple thousand there, or that’s really all you need to get going.
And, and exactly people are so focused on like trying to make a ton of money. You just gotta do the best with what you have. Right. And then build from there. All right. So, um,
Your real estate investment.
Ismail: Wanna respect your time. So I know you wanna talk about real estate. Let’s riff on that for a little bit. Like, what did you, what are you looking to do?
You said you [00:42:00] wanted to diversify and get into real estate. What’s your mindset at with
Jontay: that? I mean, just like anything for me, I wanna, uh, find ways to make my money grow by itself and not me sitting and watch or sitting. Going out and doing it myself. So with, uh, real estate, I’ve just learned a lot of people that are very successful with it.
And yeah, I’m good at trading and I have stuff in crypto and I’m making good salary, but I wanna be able to open up more streams of income. Cause I think that’s where real wealth is when you have the passive income where you aren’t doing anything or people are working for you. Uh, and not that I’m just trying to.
Figure in my bank account. Cause I think life’s much more than just numbers on a screen, but, uh, I just want freedom and I think real estate’s another avenue to get that, and I’m not sure what I’m gonna do yet fixed and flip. I feel like there’s a little time consuming and there’s lots that can go wrong with that.
I think rental properties is probably what I’m leaning towards. I just gotta learn more, get my real estate license and stuff and. [00:43:00] Find good properties to get. And I’m busy guy right now with the season going on, but off season, I’m gonna hit that. I’m gonna hit the books and I’m gonna try to get a few properties under my belt.
Ismail: Yeah. I’ve I’ve done fix and flips. Um, I haven’t done any of this year, cuz it’s so competitive out there. Like the real, I don’t know where you’re located, but the real estate, like here in New York, New Jersey. Oh my
Jontay: gosh. Yeah. That’s probably insane. Insane.
Ismail: it’s it’s gotten like I’ve seen homes lifted for six 50 selling for eight 50 in the same day.
Like it’s bonkers
Jontay: scoring. Oh my gosh. Yeah. That’s insane. Memphis is uh, very low key compared to New York. So, uh, if I was in New York, I’d probably be looking for another. Get past the income.
Ismail: Yeah. I’m actually, so I was curious to hear like what you’re thinking of doing, cuz there’s a lot like trading, there’s a lot of different styles of real estate.
Yeah. Um, I was looking at Florida because something I learned recently is that they have no capital gains tax. So a lot of my friends that are real estate investors in New York, they sell their properties up here. They do a 10 31 exchange to buy properties in Florida and then they [00:44:00] sell it there cuz there’s no capital gains down.
So it’s a way of avoiding massive tax,
Jontay: man. I’m taking notes right now. That’s that’s good info. That’s all I was looking for. I tweeted the other day, uh, real estate people DM me and I got a lot, lot of good info, but nobody said that.
Ismail: Okay. So my last two questions that I ask everyone at the internet show, um, if I interviewed people around young Jante and I’m like, Hey.
Imagine your younger self, what would people around you tell me about you if I interviewed them?
Ismail: What’d you think of him as a young kid? Would people tell me, uh, like what would they tell me? Was there any hint of a future successful trader business person, whatever, at that young age, or were you pretty normal?
Jontay: I’d say I was pretty weird. Um, and not just cuz I was hustling at a young age like that didn’t happen until seventh, eighth grade, whatever, but I was really reserved as a kid and I.
I was homeschooled up until high school. So I, I didn’t like have the biggest social life. I wasn’t going out and hanging out with friends all the time. Uh, I wasn’t like a weird homeschool kid or anything cause I played basketball. So there was some social [00:45:00] interaction, but, um, I would just hit the books. I would read a lot, I would play with my siblings, but besides that, I was very, very shy.
Just stayed in my room, read a ton. I think reading was probably the biggest thing that I, I realized not a lot of kids do or that like to do at a young.
Ismail: What’d you read? What kind of stuff?
Jontay: All types of stuff. I mean, my family, I grew up in a Christian household. I’d read the Bible all the time. Um, and I, I read a lot of novels, but I didn’t start reading, you know, like financial stuff until I got interested in that.
And then, uh, I read a lot of self-help books too, even at a young age. Uh, just how to, how to make friends and. How to, I don’t know just how to be a better person, how to live a happier life. I, I just love books and I, I prefer that over watching movies.
Ismail: So, I guess people wouldn’t be surprised to hear that you’re doing well now.
Um, cuz it sounds like you were investing time back then reading even, even if it wasn’t financial, you were [00:46:00] focusing, getting better.
Jontay: Um, yeah man, I think I always felt good about myself at the end of the night when I, uh, when I would read, when I, when I would just better myself, like you said, but I always, I always, I love movies.
I love video games, but I can’t hope, but after I’m done with them, feel a little. Like, why did I just waste all that time doing that? You know,
Ismail: I’m curious, you said you were shy more reserved and now you’re like, you’re really well spoken. You’re in the public eye. Like you just came on a podcast without hesitation.
You can speak the whole time. You don’t seem shy anymore. How’d that change?
Jontay: I don’t know, man. I, I asked myself that often actually, like when did I kind of flip that switch? I, uh, I think basketball had a big deal to do with that. My brother was like always the biggest superstar growing up. I mean, he was like number one, ranked eighth grader.
So the public guy was always on him and then consequentially me as well because I was on always on the same team as him. So I would always do interviews talking about my brother. And, uh, I was in like a, [00:47:00] a documentary of his, where I had to talk a long time. So it’s just little things you do that. Make public speaking, not as scary.
Um, so now I don’t really mind it as much, but I think once I realize that I could be well spoken or I could do this thing pretty easily, that’s kind of when I just opened the floodgates and now I, I love doing podcasts. I love speaking. Not on, not just cuz I wanna bring attention to myself because it’s just fun to have good conversations like this, you know, I just enjoy.
Ismail: no same here. That’s why I recently started this one. I had a different one, uh, that was like really focused in the event. Industry ended up being number one in the world for that industry. I’m like, you know what? I really like this, uh, you meet cool people, you have great conversations. So lemme just start my own and, and focus on that.
Jontay: Um, yeah, that’s awesome, man. I’m gonna be tuned in for sure. I, I really like how you do this.
Ismail: Thank you, man. Appreciate that. And, and, and the last question that I ask everybody, um, we talked about a lot of stuff in this conversation. Um, Clearly rich life. Isn’t just about [00:48:00] money, right? So you, you mentioned that earlier.
What is a rich life to you?
Ismail: So what is a rich life to you? Cause that’s people think it’s bound to be rich. It’s just about money, but it’s not. So to you, what do you think is a rich life?
Jontay: Dang, that’s a deep question. I think, uh, each person will have a different answer to that, but for me personally, I think a rich life is. Being happy with loved ones, having freedom to do fun stuff with loved ones and being happy with yourself and the person that you are.
So I think, uh, yeah, money is a vessel to be able to do a couple of those things. But for me personally, if I go bed happy at the end of the day with who I am, who I’m with and what I’m doing with them, and that that’s a rich life to me.
Ismail: Awesome, man. That’s a great place to leave it.
Thank You & Wrap up!
Ismail: Thank you so much for taking the time.
Um, really enjoy the conversation. Um, I learned a lot of it. So hopefully people listening will learn some stuff too, and I’ll include links to your Twitter and your disc group and everything else that we talked about in the show notes. So ante, thank you so much, man. Really, really appreciate it,
Jontay: man. Thank you for [00:49:00] having me.
I’ll talk to you later
Ismail: and there you have it. If you enjoy this episode, please remember to leave a review. I may even give you a shout out and read yours out on the show. For any and all resources that we discussed. Check out the show notes or head on over to bound to be rich.com until next time.